HeapOfDogs ,

i always called this the "wave of death"

JulyTheMonth ,

This road design seems also be done by someone completely insane. Who thought it was a good idea to cross two lanes without any kind of traffic regulations.

Luckily no every country has insane roads like that.

Gestrid ,

It doesn't just happen when both people are trying to turn. I have a busy multi-lane road near me with a left turn lane that's just past a stoplight (the stoplight is behind me, but in front of the people whose lanes I need to cross to get to where I need to go.

I'll be stopped in the turn lane waiting for traffic to clear. The stoplight will turn red, and oncoming traffic will back up past the turn lane I'm in. Someone in one of the oncoming traffic lanes will stop before the turn lane to try to let me past, but the people in the other oncoming traffic lane (who are now in my blind spot thanks to the car that stopped to try to let me through) will keep on coming. That's just an accident waiting to happen at that point.

Eyeuhnluuung ,

You go, no you go, no you go, you go, no you go

shasta ,

Yeah if this happens I'm just turning right and doing a U-turn. I would rather take 5 extra minutes to get where I'm going than play a game of polite chicken where the stakes are human lives.

paddirn ,

I was just thinking about interactions like this I've had a few times with different nice drivers, where I think they'll be trying to wave me through (no flashing brights or anything), I'm assuming to be nice, but they're far enough away that I can't see them, so I'm not entirely certain of their intent. Usually it's a busy road, so there's very little margin for error, if I misjudge what they're doing, then there's gonna be a problem. And then you both end up missing a chance to go because they screwed up the process, when, if they just hadn't tried to be nice and just went like they were supposed to, we both could've gone. Just follow the dumb traffic laws.

The exception to this though is at my kid's school. To turn into the school, there's a system that most of the parents follow and it works well, we essentially treat the entryway as a modified 3-way stop. Whoever has the easiest time to get in/get out go last in the order. So people needing to pull out and make a left turn onto the main road get first priority, then people needing to make a left turn into the school, finally people making a right-hand turn either into or out of the school go last. Anyone not going into the school just keeps going.

This system works better than when a traffic cop is occasionally posted to direct traffic (for whatever reason). With the cop, traffic gets backed up everywhere around the school and it takes everyone forever to get where they need to go. Without the cop, most people follow "the system" and traffic flows smoothly. When someone doesn't follow the system, it's not necessarily a surprise because they just don't wait, but usually a car or two later follows the system and everyone goes where they need to. You're rarely waiting for long.

halloween_spookster ,

When driving don't be nice. Be predictable.

GladiusB ,
@GladiusB@lemmy.world avatar

I'm taking a Smith system training and this is said constantly.

Gestrid ,

When driving, being predictable is being nice. Being nice is an accident waiting to happen.

... That sounded better in my head.

Anticorp ,

Half the people who wave you through have weird little control fetishes. They're not being polite, they're pursuing feelings of power. They're the same people driving 5 mph under the speed limit in the passing lane to "keep other people from speeding".

sebinspace ,

Well that’s certainly one of the takes of all time

Anticorp ,

I didn't just pull it out of my ass, it's a perspective I've seen espoused on this very platform, and also on Reddit.

jdf038 ,

I'm a high school teacher and students and parents both pull this shit. Drives me nuts.

33550336 ,
@33550336@lemmy.world avatar

Yesterday, by an accident, I made such a "generous" gesture. Thank god they did not use it.

enleeten ,

2x this if you're cycling and a driver waves you through

johannesvanderwhales ,

Ugh, I hate this. I don't care about waiting. As a cyclist, all I want is for it to be really clear what people are doing. Anything that messes with the right of way is sketchy.

glitchdx ,

People try to wave me on all the time. They refuse to move until I go. I refuse to go until I can fucking see what might fucking kill me. Twice, the guy waving me on has been rear-ended by a vehicle three times their size.

stebo02 ,
@stebo02@lemmy.dbzer0.com avatar

If a time traveler takes the effort to travel back to 2024 and try to kill me then maybe I deserve to die

JasonDJ ,

If any time traveler comes to 2024, it's either great because there's science in the future, or it's terrible, because there's something about to happen that's worth seeing first-hand.

schnurrito ,

Or it's great because something interesting is about to happen. If I had a time machine I would travel to 1989 to see the fall of the Berlin Wall.

ZC3rr0r ,

I am still thankful our parents woke us up and put us in front of the TV to watch the live broadcast of that happening. That was a watershed moment in post-war politics.

LyD ,

This happened to me, I was the fast car. Here's the dash cam video: https://streamable.com/q98ojg

aregularbeaneater ,

Dang, and they just zoom off after without a care

LyD ,

She had to slam on her brakes or she still would have hit me. When I looked back she made a clear "I fucked up" gesture that wasn't caught on cam.

stebo02 ,
@stebo02@lemmy.dbzer0.com avatar

tbh there weren't many options for them besides waiting for the entire line of cars to pass which could've taken forever

LyD ,

The guy leaving the gap tried to wave her through but I guess she didn't see the "STOP" gesture he started throwing when I got too close.

fishbone ,

To quote alice in wonderland:

"How long is forever?"

"Sometimes, just one second"

theluckyone ,

I've got several years of experience riding motorcycles. It's taught me to read traffic. I see a gap in a line of traffic like that, it's either a driver who's smart enough not to block an intersection (rare), or someone letting another someone out.

LyD ,

When I saw the gap I started watching it closely. I probably wouldn't have been able react fast enough otherwise.

alyth , (edited )

Damn, you have a store that specializes in maps, that's cool

aeharding ,
@aeharding@vger.social avatar

That's just a shitty road design

johannesvanderwhales ,

Very normal when small sidestreets are intersecting with larger roads.

aeharding , (edited )
@aeharding@vger.social avatar

45 mph multilane traffic, with unsignalized intersection of cross traffic? No, it's a shitty design. Just because it's normal where you live, doesn't mean it's a good design.

How to fix? Just a few examples...

  • Signalize intersection
  • Slow down thru traffic
  • Roundabout
  • Reduce thru lanes, increase turn lane offset
  • Prevent left turns from side street
atocci ,
@atocci@kbin.social avatar

I came to this thread to complain about a road I know that's exactly like this, but I just checked it out on Google Maps to make sure I'm complaining with proper details. and it looks like they actually added traffic signals sometime in the past few months!

johannesvanderwhales ,

Not every side street is worthy of building out a whole intersection for, or slowing down traffic for. Maybe if there actually is that much traffic turning left, but I suspect if that were the case it's likely at very specific times of day. And what, are you going to restrict cars off the side street to turning right and then making a u-turn? That's not better, especially if it's a long way to the next intersection.

This is just a common as dirt configuration, especially in rural areas. I don't find it remarkable at all.

aeharding ,
@aeharding@vger.social avatar

And what, are you going to restrict cars off the side street to turning right and then making a u-turn?

Yes. If there is not enough traffic for a better treatment, and the intersection cannot be made safer intersection, then left turns should be prohibited.

This is just a common as dirt configuration, especially in rural areas. I don’t find it remarkable at all.

Multilane thru traffic with turn lanes is not a typical rural configuration, at all.

biddy ,

Rural areas shouldn't be this busy. This design is fine as long as it's quiet, but it would take 1 more car waiting to turn left to back up the whole upbound road.

Velonie ,

Happens all the time as a cyclist at 2 way stop signs. No I don't want to go through when you've stopped and are waving me on but the other direction hasn't. I usually just shrug and point at my stop sign

starman2112 ,
@starman2112@sh.itjust.works avatar

Especially as a cyclist, there's a solid chance they're literally trying to kill you

Leviathan ,

Another thing that enrages me is people who think driving slowly is safer for whatever reason.

Getting on the highway? Let's SLOWLY merge at 60% the speed of oncoming traffic.

Changing lanes from stationary traffic into a full speed lane? I won't wait for the lane to clear, I'll just turn signal and move into the lane REAL SLOW because that's safe.

Turning right? Let's slow down to a complete stop and force traffic to a halt so I can turn right.

As a delivery truck driver I can't tell you how many people think that everyone else can just stop on a dime for them and they're being safe because they move over at a snail's Pace.

BigBananaDealer ,
@BigBananaDealer@lemm.ee avatar

fucking hate getting stuck behind some slow driver when trying to get on a highway. like fucker we are supposed to be reaching highway speed on this ramp not when we reach the highway🤬

JonEFive ,

There is an on-ramp for the highway near me that's pretty long. It's long because it's a very straight fast-moving section of highway. In other words, the on-ramp is designed to give you adequate space to get up to highway speed. The number of people who immediately merge into the first lane without getting up to speed is too damn high.

Everythingispenguins ,

I used to have a job where I drove a box truck. It was slow empty and painfully slow full. It was also speed limited to 75mph. So I would tend to hang out with the semis on the hwy. One time I was driving down the hwy and this guy in a pretty new Volvo( so the fast ones) was coming down the on ramp. I could see he was going to merge right in front of me so I slowed down to give him some space. I figured he would want to be in front of the slow box truck. As he got close to the merge he slowed down so he was even with me. I gave him a little more space to merge in front of me and slowed down again. He had plenty of room left in the on merge lane if just used the skinny pedal. Instead he waited until was almost out of room then started honking at me. I did my best to speed up my painfully slow box truck but I am sure he has to slow down to the point he was merging at 45mph as everyone was doing 75-80mph. I am sure he was cursing me too because he wasn't willing to get up to hwy speed before merging.

stalfoss ,

I was taught it was the responsibility of the car getting on the highway to match the speed of the cars on the highway. If you’re already on the highway, keep a constant speed so the people getting on can match you. So he kept having to slow down because you were also slowing down. Just like the assassin pretending to be nice in the diagram, I think you were technically in the wrong here.

Everythingispenguins ,

He never got up to hwy speed if he had he would have easily merged in front of me. I only slowed down by 5 to 10 mph.

AngryMob ,

Right, but its not your responsibility to slow down at all. Its kind of you to do so when the merging vehicle picks up on your intention, but when they don't, it makes a miscommunication like you describe.

Basically, i'd just describe it as being predictable. And bending the rules (even to be kind) is not predictable, usually.

biddy ,

I have a question on this. Let's assume everyone is a perfect driver and must have at least a 2 second following distance at all times. If there's a free flowing queue of traffic on the highway with 2-4 second gaps between, merging in is impossible without someone slowing down and letting you in. Every time I merge this situation stresses me out.

stalfoss ,

Merge into the gap, then slow down slightly to extend the space in front of you, and let the guy behind you slow down to extend the space in front of him. It’s not complicated

Leviathan ,

At 100 km/h (low-end highway spreed), or 1,666 m/minute, or 27.7 m per second, a 2 second gap leaves approximately 56.6 m (185.6 feet) between cars. With the average car length being ~4.9 m (~16 feet), even the absolute worst driver can merge in a space ten times the size of the average car, assuming they're matching highway speed.

Most people have no actual concept of how long 2 seconds actually is or how much space it would leave in reality.

biddy , (edited )

Yeah, obviously you "can" merge, but in doing so you insert yourself into the middle of a 2 second gap creating 2 × less than 1 second gaps. Like I said, in this hypothetical everyone is a perfect driver that always follows the rules, so that's not an option.

For that matter, the driver behind should see that you are about to merge into a gap that's too small and slow down to leave a space that's at least 4 seconds big.

I'd also like to point out that your attitude to driving is terrible, the size in meters of anything on a highway is irrelevant, 2 seconds is not a lot of time to react and slow down a car at 100, and that just because you "can" do something doesn't mean you should.

MajorHavoc ,

Instead he waited until was almost out of room then started honking at me.

People who haven't learned the physics of large trucks spend a surprising portion of their driving time competing for Darwin awards.

I want to will this not to be a problem anymore, but still see it all the time. I'm thankful that I've seen a lot of truckers react in surprisingly aware ways that save lives.

But every time I see it, I can't help but think that driver's luck isn't too likely to hold through too many more times making that move.

Jolteon ,

Getting into the fast moving lane from slow traffic is difficult no matter how you do it. The best way I found is to actually go slightly slower than the person in front of you to get a gap, then use that gap to accelerate.

Leviathan ,

Yeah, that's because you know how to drive. I can't tell you how many people just turn in front of a truck and expect it to slow down for them. Playing with their lives.

Anticorp ,

People are fucking stupid. People behind the wheel of a car are even more stupid.

Leviathan ,

Yup. Be predictable, not courteous. You'll save lives.

I'm fine with moving forward and using his car as my new stop line until the lane is clear. He's the asshole for assuming everyone waiting behind him wants to be as courteous and patient.

scrubbles ,
@scrubbles@poptalk.scrubbles.tech avatar

Thank you!

You're not being kind by doing this! You're being kind to the one person you see but being an asshole to everyone behind you! Follow the rules of the road and everyone will get on better.

ameancow ,

Nothing like getting to a 4-way stop and the cycle is going smoothly then some dipshit starts waving cars and throws everything out of whack and next thing you know everyone is inching forward at the same time.

Equally bad, the entry drives into shopping centers are often made to not stop when entering the lot, this way during busy shopping times traffic won't back up out into the street. This is a normal, common thing, usually plastered with signs "INCOMING TRAFFIC DOES NOT STOP" and you still get people stopping and waving cars through, thinking they're doing anyone a favor, when instead it's confusing everyone as to what the rules are at the intersection. Then cars start driving around each other and you get to hear that sickening "scrrrunch-POP" as the other lane started moving without noticing the rules had changed.

I have a feeling these are the same people who push a full cart into the self-checkout having never used a self-checkout in their lives.

Semi_Hemi_Demigod ,
@Semi_Hemi_Demigod@lemmy.world avatar

People always complain about Altimas because they're unpredictable, but the absolute worst offenders I see are Honda CRV drivers specifically because they're trying to be polite on the road. I'd take some busted Altima weaving through traffic over a CRV who decides to be nice and stop at the end of the onramp so they don't cut anyone off.

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