Men's Liberation

villasv , in The Will To Change Men, Masculinity, And Love By bell hooks

Good book. Surprisingly sympathetic to men, which makes the whole thing a lot more palatable to the target audience.

Great recommendation.

dumples , in The Will To Change Men, Masculinity, And Love By bell hooks
@dumples@kbin.social avatar

I have read her book Feminism Is for Everybody which is amazing. Saving this to read in its entirety

fracture , in The Will To Change Men, Masculinity, And Love By bell hooks

bell hooks, rest in peace. truly an incredible author, i originally learned of her from the news she had passed away :(

just wanted to post to let people know that she styled her name literally "bell hooks", as all lowercase

pmk , in The Will To Change Men, Masculinity, And Love By bell hooks

When I read this I kept anticipating some twist where the author would turn around and say "but... actually none of your problems matter and all the problems in the world is your personal fault". But the twist never came, and I think it was the first time I read a feminist author that seemed to genuinely care about me as a person. Not as an instrument for other purposes, but just because I'm a person in this world.

spaduf Mod , in The Will To Change Men, Masculinity, And Love By bell hooks
@spaduf@slrpnk.net avatar

I'm gonna link this in the sidebar.

agent_flounder , (edited ) in The Will To Change Men, Masculinity, And Love By bell hooks
@agent_flounder@lemmy.world avatar

I'm in the process of reading this (and a dozen other books lol). Interesting so far. Haven't formed opinions yet. But definitely appreciate Bell Hooks bell hooks for having tackled this subject.

Firebirdie713 ,

Hey, just as an FYI, bell hooks specifically asked that her name not be capitalized. Takes a bit of getting used to, but wanted to pop a message in so that people knew the spelling on the cover shown here is deliberate.

agent_flounder ,
@agent_flounder@lemmy.world avatar

Appreciate that. Will fix.

BlastboomStrice , in The Will To Change Men, Masculinity, And Love By bell hooks
@BlastboomStrice@mander.xyz avatar

I highly suggest this one, a friend of mine has read it and she was showing me parts of the book. It's in my "to read" list.

Cryophilia , in What is the Triad of Male Violence and how does violence manifest against oneself

I haven't fully read the article, but just from skimming it, it doesn't really present any solutions, does it? Just "stop being traditionally masculine bro". That's not terribly helpful.

spaduf OP Mod ,
@spaduf@slrpnk.net avatar

There's a degree to which deconstruction of these sorts of topics automatically does work to dismantle them. For those with an egalitarian inclination, it is usually enough to point out unfair actions they have taken in the past to prevent them in the future. Obviously, there's a lot more external pressure here (one of the main focuses of the article) but I would argue this is even more relevant in that case.

If we were to try to teach a fish how to clean the water they live in, we must first start with what water is.

Cryophilia ,

That's fair. At points in the article, I was thinking "duh" but that may not be true for everyone. Perhaps I'm just not the audience.

What do you think an alternative to traditional masculinity might look like?

spaduf OP Mod ,
@spaduf@slrpnk.net avatar

I actually think that we're all better off without normative gender roles. To that end, I think that any attempt to define an alternative masculinity leaves you with something that is just as restrictive.

Cryophilia ,

What is gender if we don't have a societal idea of gender? Is it nothing? The existence of trans people suggests that many, probably most of us, have an innate yearning for at least a loose idea of gender identity.

spaduf OP Mod ,
@spaduf@slrpnk.net avatar

So I'm not necessarily advocating for a world without individual gender expression. The key difference here is external vs internal pressures.

Cryophilia , in In the age of relentless online pornography, chatrooms, sexting and smartphones, the way teenage boys learn about relationships has changed dramatically

Okay this whole "sex bad" thing has got to stop, I'm getting sick of it. I thought we were moving past ignorance like that.

kent_eh , in In the age of relentless online pornography, chatrooms, sexting and smartphones, the way teenage boys learn about relationships has changed dramatically

Another factor is the increasing focus on work from home, and remote learning.

The less "forced" in-person interaction you have with a wide range of people, the less practice you get in developing the social skills that would be useful in navigating relationships later in life.

CaptObvious , in In the age of relentless online pornography, chatrooms, sexting and smartphones, the way teenage boys learn about relationships has changed dramatically

Why are we all talking about a story from 10 years ago? It’s hardly news. And things have changed, at least a little, in the last decade

spaduf OP Mod ,
@spaduf@slrpnk.net avatar

Definitely didn't realize this was such an old article. Side note, it's probably also worthwhile to discuss how things have changed in the past decade.

some_guy , in In the age of relentless online pornography, chatrooms, sexting and smartphones, the way teenage boys learn about relationships has changed dramatically

There was a kid staying with a relative (I think) in a building across from me and I joked that I’d start blasting hardcore porn on my projector with my blinds up to teach him about the birds and the bees.

riskable , in In the age of relentless online pornography, chatrooms, sexting and smartphones, the way teenage boys learn about relationships has changed dramatically
@riskable@programming.dev avatar

"We are living in a highly sexualized society."

History would disagree. We're still living in a society shaped by Quaker beliefs about sex, children, and the human body in general.

It's telling that the article didn't interview anyone with expertise on the history of sex or people who study sex professionally (as academic scientists and researchers). Porn is definitely more easily viewed than ever before and that may be shaping kids views of sexuality but how is that shaping adult's views of sexuality? Why are kids special?

I'll tell you why kids are special: It's because it has become acceptable to assume that kids being exposed to sex of any kind is somehow "bad". Nowhere in the article do they talk about why it is that kids aren't learning about healthy sexual relationships: Because we hide that from them.

No one wants to talk to their kids about sex but if there's one thing you should tell kids (not just your own!) about porn it's this: It's fake

Donkter ,

It's the classic puritanical/quaker view of sexuality. Kids should be shielded and protected from any mention of sex and sexuality. Then when they turn 18 or get into their first sexual situations a switch is flipped and they're chastised for not "knowing better".

e_t_ Admin ,

Why are kids special?

I think of that quote:

“The unborn” are a convenient group of people to advocate for. They never make demands of you; they are morally uncomplicated, unlike the incarcerated, addicted, or the chronically poor; they don’t resent your condescension or complain that you are not politically correct; unlike widows, they don’t ask you to question patriarchy; unlike orphans, they don’t need money, education, or childcare; unlike aliens, they don’t bring all that racial, cultural, and religious baggage that you dislike; they allow you to feel good about yourself without any work at creating or maintaining relationships; and when they are born, you can forget about them, because they cease to be unborn.

Children aren't quite as good as the unborn, but they're close. Advocating for children still lets you feel good about yourself without having to actually associate with children. They're a group it's pretty much OK to be paternalistic toward. If they do resent your condescension, you can easily write it off because they're just children.

gap_betweenus ,

So glad you brought it up. Not only sex but romantic partnership in general seems to be the one thing people need to somehow figure out on their own.

Pat_Riot ,
@Pat_Riot@lemmy.today avatar

I answer every question my son has honestly and in plain, easily understood language. He's in middle school. Boy are his friends being fed some bullshit from their parents and unfettered access to the Internet. Smile and nod, kiddo, then come ask me. If I don't know, we'll look it up together, but I will not keep him in the dark. The dangerous thing about sex is ignorance of it. And yeah, porn ain't real.

autotldr Bot , in In the age of relentless online pornography, chatrooms, sexting and smartphones, the way teenage boys learn about relationships has changed dramatically

This is the best summary I could come up with:


He recently left his local comprehensive in a gritty part of south London with good GCSE results and wants to do an engineering apprenticeship after his A-levels.

"The vast majority of young people just want a nice boyfriend or girlfriend, but they are living in a highly sexualised society that makes things very confusing."

Poor-quality sex education is a common complaint among experts: too much time spent putting condoms on bananas and not enough teaching children about healthy relationships and debunking myths about what is normal sexual behaviour.

In July, BMJ Open (a sister publication to the British Medical Journal) published an article that aimed to "explore expectations, experiences and circumstances of anal sex among young people".

The study was carried out by researchers at the London School of Hygiene and Tropical Medicine who interviewed 130 male and female teenagers aged between 16 and 18 in heterosexual relationships.

Given the right encouragement, teenage boys are keen to tackle thorny issues such as misogyny and consent, and want to develop the emotional skills to help them handle their relationships.


The original article contains 2,821 words, the summary contains 178 words. Saved 94%. I'm a bot and I'm open source!

Paragone , in CW:SH - Why more men than women die by suicide

A psychiatrist explained to me, years ago, that women are much more likely to attempt suicide, but by using less-violent means, are much less-likely to succeed in terminating their lives.

Males are less likely to try it, but more likely to succeed.

Girls/women usually try pills, overdoses, guys usually try something violent.

See the "more suicides are tried by girls & women" part of the equation, not just the "more successful suicides are by males" part of the equation.

( I've faint marks from when I opened both wrists with a scalpel-blade, when I was about 10yo, and haven't had the guts to intentionally make-absolutely-certain of my termination .. perhaps-ever.

Both parts of the equation I'm identifying are offensive/wrong, and mis-representing of what's actually going on, as various "activist" factions do, is what I'm attacking. )

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