xkcd

crystalmerchant , in xkcd #2948: Electric vs Gas

On the other other hand, gas car makers have regulators by the ballsack. So we've got that going for us which is nice

sudoku ,

Well maybe in your 3-rd world they do.

oo1 , in xkcd #2948: Electric vs Gas

Someone has to build quite a few more power stations though.
Assuming you're talking about swapping a large fraction of the car fleet to EV, not just a few here and there.
That's a substantial increase in total electricity demand. Enough to radically impact the load on the grid.

And if you end up burning natual gas / coal to meet the marginal increase in demand - as would seem fairly likely - then much of the thermal conversion losses you're saving in the higehr efficieny motor just get shifted to the furnace in the power station and transmission/distribution system; so that can erode some of the efficiency benefits.

I guess you could require for every new EV that they also install roftop solar PV and basically buy a spare battery of near same capacity as the car. that might push the up front and periodic replacement cost a bit though - quite nice for the running costs i guess.

Another good alternative is to try to convince people to get together and share their electric motors in things callled trains and do as many trips in those as possible - that's not too popular with most people unless the road congestion is really bad. Something to do with sharing being communism i think,

tiredofsametab ,

And if you end up burning natual gas / coal to meet the marginal increase in demand - as would seem fairly likely - then much of the thermal conversion losses you're saving in the higehr efficieny motor just get shifted to the furnace in the power station and transmission/distribution system; so that can erode some of the efficiency benefits.

  1. liquid fuels still have to get from the ground -> refinery -> distribution -> gas station -> vehicle so there is transmission cost and loss there
  2. "we can't immediately solve all of the problems so let's not do it" is a pretty bad take. Incremental progress is better than waiting for perfect which basically means never doing it.

Another good alternative is to try to convince people to get together and share their electric motors in things callled trains and do as many trips in those as possible - that's not too popular with most people unless the road congestion is really bad. Something to do with sharing being communism i think,

I 100% agree everywhere it's practical. Still, people are going to have to get to train stations somehow. Multi-modal transit could somewhat cover that, but some people would still practically have to drive. Convincing those people to only drive to the nearest station and not all the way to their destination is another challenge to solve.

rickyrigatoni , in xkcd #2948: Electric vs Gas
@rickyrigatoni@lemm.ee avatar

Gas engines smell good 🥰

explodicle ,

Eventually that'll be one of the quaint old timey smells at the county fair.

PhlubbaDubba , in xkcd #2948: Electric vs Gas

From personal experience, you also need a garage to keep an electric car in if you're in an extreme cold climate, those batteries can fail if in the deep cold for long enough and those car companies do NOT have the replacement parts in stock to fix it quickly.

areyouevenreal ,

This is why modern EVs need heating and cooling systems for their batteries. Did you have a Nissan Leaf by any chance?

PhlubbaDubba ,

Nah, Chevy Volt

Addv4 ,

First Gen?

PhlubbaDubba ,

Final gen

gamermanh ,
@gamermanh@lemmy.dbzer0.com avatar

I live in an area with the exact opposite issue (my battery MELTED) so I'm probably wrong, but isn't that what the battery blankets they try to sell you on when you buy an EV is for?

PlaidBaron ,
@PlaidBaron@lemmy.world avatar

I live in Canada and own a Bolt. Its a pretty unremarkable EV from a tech standpoint. It keeps the batteries at the right temp by heating and cooling them. It really doesnt require any extra effort or special equipment.

someguy3 , (edited )

I think in certain areas for your EV you want a gas powered heater for the battery and cabin. That's how I think EV transit buses should do it too.

danc4498 , in xkcd #2947: Pascal's Wager Triangle

I’m not sure I get what this is saying.

homura1650 , (edited )

Blaise Pascal is famous for 2 things:

  1. Pascal's triangle. This describes how to expand expresions of the form (a+b)^n as well as to compute how many ways there are to pick k objects out of a set of n (ignoring order.

This triangle is computed by starting with 1 at the tip, then having each element be the some of its 2 parents (except the diagonal edges with only one parent, which remains as 1)

  1. Pascal's wager. This is a theological argument for a belief in god that goes "if you believe and god doesn't exist, nothing happens. If you don't believe and he does exist, you suffer for eternity. The logical choice is therefore to believe"

The natural conclusion is therefore to believe in all gods. If procelatizing happens in just the right way, and no one realizes people are talking about the same god, you end up with a triangle of polytheists, where the number of gods they believe in is given by Pascal's triangle.

Edit: gid -> god

danc4498 ,

Thanks! I wasn’t familiar with 1.

BradleyUffner ,

All hail Gid!

Ookami38 ,

Gid is gud

Crashumbc ,

Finally something to believe in.

TeddE ,
@TeddE@lemmy.world avatar

Pascal was a famous thinker of their time, particularly in mathematics.

Two of the ideas they're remembered for are Pascals Triangle and Pascals Wager.

Their triangle is a helpful tool for combinations of things. Their wager is a (kinda bad in my opinion) argument for why you should believe in the Christian God.

The xkcd comic is a combination of both ideas

BradleyUffner ,

Ahh, so I did actually understand it... I thought for sure I was missing something since they are usually way more clever than this.

blindbunny , (edited ) in xkcd #2948: Electric vs Gas

I'm big into motorcycles and all the electric motorcycles are like 100 lbs more and go through tires like twice a year compared to my gas powered motorcycle changing tires once everyother year and can go fraction of the distance. Idk I want to think electric is the future but with these limits I'm still not too interested. If hydrogen ever comes to motorcycles like Kawasaki, Honda, Yamaha and Suzuki want, I'll definitely get one of those but I can't recommend any electric motorcycles right now and before you say anything I would recommend a Surron if you check your welds before you buy those are great commuters but probably not a motorcycle.

ASeriesOfPoorChoices ,

I'm genuinely confused - why are you going through tires so quickly?

blindbunny ,

Sorry for not being clear, I change tires on my gas powered commuter motorcycle about once every two years. Electric motorcycles seem to go through tires much faster it was explained to me that the bikes are heavier and most tires aren't designed for electric motorcycles.

ASeriesOfPoorChoices ,

that just sounds like too much throttle because you're not familiar with the extra torque from take off.

nothing to do with a little extra weight.

my last two bikes were over 1L, with a curb weight of something like 280kg, maybe. 45kg extra in batteries is like a child or a big dog. it's not much.

not enough to double your wear rate.

Atelopus-zeteki ,
@Atelopus-zeteki@kbin.run avatar

The torque off the start is so much higher in EVs vs. ICE. I'm not sure from u/blindbunny 's post if they've ridden an EV motorcyle. I'm pretty sure they haven't owned one. They sound like an ICE shill. My bicycle's torque off the start is pretty low, and dependent on this old school "neuro-musculo-skeletal" system. It's kinda jankety, but I'm too cheap to upgrade.

blindbunny ,

I wish I was a shill I'd probably have more money to buy more motorcycles. I've rode a Surron bee? and a Stark VARG and I kinda like how quite they are especially dual sporting. But it takes almost half a day to charge the Stark VARG and the longest I've rode a Surron was about ~20 miles before it needed to charge.

IrateAnteater ,

Many motorcycles (not bicycles, those are irrelevant to the comparison) already have more torque off the line than the available traction can handle, so that benefit from electric motors is less critical. The wear is a concern because motorcycles are already more sensitive to tire wear than cars, and simply switching to a harder compound to account for the extra weight has other ramifications that are far less severe in electric cars.

Atelopus-zeteki ,
@Atelopus-zeteki@kbin.run avatar

Fair. I've been comparing ICE vs EV cars wrt tire wear. And some folks, depending on driving style, find that the tires wear faster on EVs. Slow off the line should moderate that.

someguy3 ,

Long term we'll get lighter batteries.

blindbunny ,

That's what people keep telling me

Atelopus-zeteki ,
@Atelopus-zeteki@kbin.run avatar

And over time power density in batteries has increased. So far.

Graphically:
https://www.epectec.com/images/battery-comparison-energy-density.jpg

From ArsTechnica:
https://arstechnica.com/science/2021/05/eternally-five-years-away-no-batteries-are-improving-under-your-nose/

And from Cleantechnica as of January 2024:
https://cleantechnica.com/2024/01/30/the-rise-of-batteries-in-6-charts-not-too-many-numbers/

People just won't stop telling you this, it seems. ;-)

blindbunny ,

Well they never provided evidence like you did. Thanks friend.

Atelopus-zeteki ,
@Atelopus-zeteki@kbin.run avatar

You betcha BB! Have a great day!

cm0002 ,

all the electric motorcycles are like 100 lbs more and go through tires like once a year

compared to my gas powered motorcycle changing tires twice a year

...so, you're changing tires less on an electric motorcycle? I don't see the issue

blindbunny ,

Sorry I edited the post poorly 😞

kbal ,
@kbal@fedia.io avatar

Yeah, a general "electric vs. gas" comparison which elides the two big disadvantages of electric in familiar applications (which aren't to be found in the motor) seems slightly subpar for xkcd. It's valid from a certain narrow engineering perspective but not too helpful if what you're thinking about is motorcycles.

If fossil fuels were so easy to give up we'd have done it by now.

HubertManne , in xkcd #2947: Pascal's Wager Triangle

I always took pascals wager as just being about some nebulous creator type of thing with no real specifics because the argument can't really handle specifics.

stinerman ,
@stinerman@midwest.social avatar

It was specifically about the Christian God because all others were "obviously" incorrect. It's terrible logic because it discounts:

  1. God somehow doesn't know you're believing in him "just in case" rather than because of actual faith.
  2. The wager implies that you should be an adherent of the religion that gets you the most stuff in the afterlife.
HubertManne ,

ooh I like point 2. i have a new question now for thiests. well ya know allahs offering me a harem of 72 comely virgins. whats your offer?

hperrin ,

72 sluts.

HubertManne ,

im listening.

hikaru755 ,

the religion that gets you the most stuff in the afterlife.

I think it would be rather the opposite, should be the one that promises the worst fate in the afterlife to non-believers

joyjoy , in xkcd #2948: Electric vs Gas

On one hand, electric motors [...]
On the other hand, electric motors [...]

Typo?

algorithmae ,

That's the joke

joyjoy ,

Reading the alt-text makes it more obvious.

ASeriesOfPoorChoices ,

you found the joke, now the next step is to get it.

odium , in xkcd #2947: Pascal's Wager Triangle

Hinduism with 330 million gods somewhere deep down that tree.

lars ,

Since I read that number for the first time last month, I’ve been wondering which seems wilder to a Hindu: monotheists or atheists?

Everythingispenguins ,

Monotheists 100%

lars ,

I want to believe this, so—unlike monotheists in such a situation—I am suspicious of the answer

MBM ,

I think some Hindus would say they're monotheists because all gods are just different aspects of Brahman. Don't quote me on this though.

Sam_Bass , in xkcd #2947: Pascal's Wager Triangle

Kali giggles

jungle , in xkcd #2947: Pascal's Wager Triangle

Brilliant! This is one of those things that when you see it, it seems so obvious that you wonder how nobody thought of it until now. But it takes someone like Randall to pluck it out of the space of unexplored ideas and present it perfectly.

pineapplelover , in What if you drained the oceans?

Thanks for this post. I totally forgot I bought his What If? book and it's sitting on my shelf.

brbposting , in What if you drained the oceans?

Love it.

Why’s the Netherlands controlling everything again?

Sianna ,

It's the natural state of affairs, duh.

NocturnalEngineer , in What if you drained the oceans?

Now I'm wondering what the minimum amount of water required to sustain the current levels of life on earth.

LostXOR ,

I think that would be the current amount of water. Any water loss (or water gain for that matter) is going to cause massive problems worldwide.

DemBoSain , in What if you drained the oceans?
@DemBoSain@midwest.social avatar

I'm kinda interested in what Mars would look like with all that water. Small northern ocean, or small southern continent?

threelonmusketeers OP ,

That idea was actually explored in Drain the Oceans: Part II, on the xkcd website. I hope Randall makes a video version of that as well.

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