MRA is kind of the inverse i think because it typically is just about mens rights not egalitarianism. At least in my experience with it online.
I can accept im wrong if put to the test but i dont think im wrong enough that ill wait for a convincing argument before i burden myself with slogging through that much slop to find if theres good stuff underneath
It's the only way to defeat the labrenthine security measures that keep people from going into the wrong bathroom.
I remember once at a Cracker Barrel shortly after we had our first kid, my wife was in the ladies' room trying to change a bad, bad diaper. We were expecting a 3 Mile Island, but this was Chernobyl. She hollered for help.
I panicked for a moment but remembered my training. I only just made it past the cross-cutting grid of lasers using some parkour, the riddle guards where one always lies, and the other always tells the truth, and the spike pits with swinging vines over them. I definitely don't remember just fast-walking in there, eyes to the floor, loudly apologizing to nobody in particular.
Once containment and remediation were complete, we enjoyed our meal without incident. The child was especially fond of apple butter.
If I had known I could have avoided all that by simply attending decades of therapy, being abandoned by my family, going through painful binding, and multiple reconstructive surgeries which I had to save up for and purchase myself because they weren't covered by insurance and taking handfuls of pills everyday to try and regulate my hormone levels for some semblance of peace if a body I knew wasn't actually mine...man that would have saved me so much work.
I wish this person a sense of belonging and if being loved for what they are. Even by themselves. It does really make clear what kind of handicap gender dysphoria is, it reads like a irl purgatory.
I worked with some 50yo gay black men who shared how deeply that had to hide who they were for decades. Even in the 90s, there was violent assault because you were gay. Police frequently turned a blind eye.
People say things like "Just leave people alone" and yet someone come out of the closet, and they want them removed from society.
It's an interesting read - a lot of her experiences she's discussing boil down to feeling she was ignored or her voice minimized because of her perceived gender identity and assumptions about how she was raised and what she would feel.
I liked her discussion and thought her perspective on purposely not transitioning was an interesting view. This was a really good analogy and drove home the point for me:
Imagine, dear reader, a cis-woman evenly saying:
“I wish I looked like that but I don’t and can’t. It sucks and it makes me feel really awful if I brood on it. That’s why I focus on my writing—I’d rather make things. Investing in and building things that aren’t my body helps me cope with the body issues I’ve been saddled with against my will.”
She doesn’t sound like she needs advice on how makeup will actually fix her core problem, does she? She seems like she’s doing alright. I’m her and I’m trans. That’s all.
Some big quotes that hit home through this post were
Do I need to be inspected and dissected by the people who laughed at me in order to receive my credential?
“I play along,” one of them told me, “because in the queer community the only people who defend cisboys are cisboys. I don’t want to give up finally being read as a girl.”
Oof.
I don't know if it's just the sections of the internet I frequent these days, but this intense, misandrist views don't seem to be as common as they once were, and not as accepted.
I was born into that shitty town, maleness, in the remains of outdated ideals and misplaced machismo and repression and there are some good people stuck living there. They are not in charge. They did not build it. And I don’t feel okay just moving out and saying “fuck y’all — bootstrap your way out or die out, I was never one of you.” I want to make it a better, healthier place—not spend all my time talking about how shitty it is and how anyone who would choose to live there deserves it.
the misandry has become less acceptable over time, probably as more "cis" girls like i was realized we weren't so cis or girls and made some of those actually cis girls confront the things they'd said and thought during that time
but also we've become a lot more aware of how the patriarchy hurts men, and we've also become more broadly aware of feminist authors like bell hooks, who have been writing about how men need feminism too all along
Cis woman here. I run in pretty leftist circles and whilst I don't see open misandry as much anymore, I also don't see as many people speaking about men's issues as I'd like. If I do see people speaking about men or masculinity in a problematic way, it's usually people who are receptive to being challenged, once I've pointed things out.
I appreciate that you call people out on these things. My experience with pointing things out or seeing online conversations where someone else pointing it out has been very different. That's not to say what you're saying doesn't happen. It's probably just different based on where exactly on the internet we've been. Granted, leftist areas of the internet has this issue less, but it's not zero.
Like let's take a conversation about men that are virgins. The more comments there are, the more likely it is that at least one person will make fun of this category of men. And in the cases I've seen, any attempts to counter this is met with "Lol the virgin outed himself". Very rarely does an actual conversation happen (again, in the cases I've seen), because any arguments brought forward about why we shouldn't shame men for being virgins is shot down as invalid because the person bringing these arguments is a virgin. Or heck, he might not even be one, but the other person has already made up their mind on the virginity status of the commenter.
And the fact that it's present, albeit not as often, in leftist spaces as well is really harming and it can push people in the other direction. I'm in my 20s, a leftist man and a virgin, but I was fortunate enough to form my opinions on a lot of issues without encountering douchebags like Andrew Tate. But what about someone that's a teenager right now, doesn't have any opinions on political stuff yet, but sees the left that's fighting for no discrimination, making fun of virgins, which he is? He goes to see what the other side is saying, and boom, he's trapped in there now. Of course, the past couple sentences is my idea of what might go through this hypothetical guy's mind. So it's not that I think the left as a whole makes fun of virgins, but from where my example guy is standing, it could seem that way when a lot of people say those things and they go unchallenged.
Sorry for the long rant, but it's basically a really long way of saying: I'm glad you're calling this shit out and keep at it!
Absolutely captivating read, I almost backed away just from the sheer length of it but now I’m sending it to others lol. Vivid and powerful, you can really feel the knot twisting around in her stomach. Interesting too that it was written so long ago, and looking back at her perspective now seeing how the social phenomenons she wrote about have evolved
In general, good points but I'm seriously annoyed by glossing over education gap. It has diasterous effects on building relationships and in the long run on fertility.
I'm happy to see someone express that opinion. I have so much in common with this guy's stance on things (and even a lot of the bitterness) but I just can't stand watching him. I really, really don't like the "I'm hungover and angry" schtick and it makes it hard to watch.
Also in this camp. The news he covers is depressing enough without purposefully making it more gloomy. I've liked him just fine on things like Behind the Bastards where he's just been regular Cody. Robert will beat some things into the ground, but for the most part it's tolerable because he's just trying to lighten the mood.
I wish some of these podcasters and YouTubers would just be themselves and let the content speak for itself. They do a great job and don't need bits to get attention. I'd think anyone watching it for the bits doesn't really care about the message anyway.
I don't mind a good takedown video but I'm not big on alcoholism as the punchline. "I drink because I'm so angry about this" just doesn't resonate with me
But in his defense, his fans LOVE that presentation style and he's catering to them.
I also had no idea he was in the Behind The Bastards crew! I wanted to check it out but I only drive for like 20 minutes twice a week (and that was my podcast time)
Robert has the same substance abuse jokes, which are the ones in particular that annoy me also, but it's generally just at the ad breaks when I hit skip anyway. They were together at Cracked, and many of his guests are former Cracked employees. I gave up on Cody's show with that Wormbo puppet thing becoming a regular feature. That on top of the downer mood was too much for me.
The actual Behind that Bastards show is my favorite of the group's work, but if you're interested in their product but also interested in social activism and learning about political movements, unions, immigration, and civil rights, perhaps give their It Could Happen Here a listen. I listen to it in the big weekly compilation, but it's a series of 20-30 minute stories, each hosted by a different person on the team.
He has the occasional show on happy things, too. I like the shtick but it did take me awhile to warm up to it, and I could see how others couldn't get to that point. Tbh, I think the puppet helped me, too. Muppets automatically add silliness and happiness to any show. Except for maybe the Dark Crystal lol.
I enjoy it in some moods, not as much in others. I generally like it for 20 minutes but can't watch an entire episode at once. My ex would just screech "WHAT IS THAT TURN IT OFF I CAN'T TAKE IT" but well, that's sort of how I feel about her.
In defense of his exasperation, the topics he discusses generally are infuriating and deserve such treatment.
I’m not sure I understand your second sentence but the background is that he is famous for being on a team that has won multiple Super Bowls. He was invited to give a commencement address at his Alma mater and said some crazy shit.
This is a very thoughtful discussion of “incels” and the unique challenges men face today.
It addresses male loneliness and the colossal changes in society—in terms of economics and sexuality—that have greatly affected men over the last few generations.
It also highlights many of the ways in which incel identity is misunderstood, presenting the phenomenon in a wider context—allowing space for greater understanding and empathy.
It’s kind of hard to summarize, it really is “Patriarchy 101” (or maybe 102) with the Barbie movie as a narrative base. It was good to hear things I’ve intuited explicitly stated
Men's Liberation
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