Episode Discussion | Star Trek: Strange New Worlds | 2x04 "Among the Lotus Eaters"

Written by Kirsten Beyer & Davy Perez

Directed by Eduardo Sanchez

LoglineReturning to a planet that dredges up tragic memories, Captain Pike and his landing party find themselves forgetting everything, including their own identities as he confronts a ghost from his past.

Jon-H558 ,

I mean its a little far fetched a simple helmet protects the kmal yet the enterprise hull let it through no problems (until pack modulates the shield), but wont let that get in the way of a good story.

echo ,

their helmets are made of a special ore that blocks the radiation. it’s a goofy explanation, but there is a reason why they act differently than the enterprise hull

TeaHands ,
@TeaHands@lemmy.world avatar

Really enjoyed this episode, it didn’t make the most sense at times but made up for it with an extremely disturbing core concept. And there is comfort in the idea that even without a significant portion of our memories, we’re still “us”.

I’m confused about one thing though and maybe I just missed something so someone can enlighten me. If the palace is so well-protected that just literally being inside it for ten minutes is enough to completely reverse the memory loss, why was Pike first affected by it while standing in the palace? Is it just that they weren’t in there for very long during their first encounter with Zac, and the symptoms caught up with him, or did I miss something about how that worked?

Argonne ,

Yeah this episode didn’t make much sense. Outside of the disturbing concept and well directed drama, this episode felt pretty weak

TeaHands ,
@TeaHands@lemmy.world avatar

It didn’t really bother me, still thought it was a very good episode, but I am glad it’s not just me being stupid!

polymorphist_neuroid ,

OK, can someone help me out? I had major deja-vu with the scene where Spock tells Ortegas she can’t go on the field trip away mission. Wasn’t there another episode where Ortegas was about to get to go on an away mission and got told she couldn’t at the last minute? Or did I maybe see that scene in a preview or something?

ValueSubtracted OP Mod ,
@ValueSubtracted@startrek.website avatar

That scene was shown at one of the major conventions last year, so you may have seen it then.

r2vq ,
@r2vq@lemmy.ca avatar

It was shared late last year as a preview. YouTube

sabremows ,
@sabremows@meow.social avatar

I'm primarily curious about Batel's job responsibilities. Her main job seems to be as a JAG officer but she also has a field command on the Cayuga?

ValueSubtracted OP Mod ,
@ValueSubtracted@startrek.website avatar

She was in command of the Cayuga in “A Quality of Mercy” as well - it seems that’s her regular gig, and she was assigned Una’s prosecution because…well, that’s how Starfleet rolls, I guess.

InverseParallax ,

I think she was asked by starfleet since she was close, then asked to do jag duty (?!) As a test of her fitness for higher command, which she should have passed.

TheGayTramp ,
@TheGayTramp@lemmy.ca avatar

Everyone knows that ship captains are the best lawyers. That’s why starfleet keeps using them as attorneys in all their trials

milkisklim ,

Maybe the Cayuga performs a support mission? It can do standard starship stuff but also specializes in social work, like diplomacy, legal services, law enforcement, politics, etc

TheGayTramp ,
@TheGayTramp@lemmy.ca avatar

Even if that were the case and the Cayuga is a flying legal-aid clinic it doesn’t make much sense to put the lawyer in charge. You’d have a regular command officer trained to fly spaceships running the ship, and Batel would be like the chief counsel or whatever aboard. But they also did it weird with Crusher too when they made her the captain of a hospital ship. Again, you’d have a ship-captain-type-person flying the thing, and a doctor in charge of the doctoring

crazycanadianloon ,

Ok, at the risk of sounding like a filthy casual, it’s only now when I’m digging into Memory Alpha that I realized we’re finally getting visualization of what Pike was so miserable about in TOS the Cage. I was like, why does Rigel VII sound so familiar…

This is the kind of retcon I live for!!

TeaHands ,
@TeaHands@lemmy.world avatar

I’ve been watching Trek since I was basically a baby but don’t have anywhere near the depth of knowledge of most people posting here. We are still valid!

deepthaw ,

I like that the original away mission failing wasn’t some weird magical thing - it was just a mission that went bad in a fairly mundane way.

ComptitiveSubset ,

This episode belongs together with the better episodes of TNG. I liked it a lot.

GummySquirrel ,
@GummySquirrel@startrek.website avatar

I’ve been waiting for the crew explore a new planet. Hoping there’s more of these episodes than less

Disgustoid ,

Wow, these SNW writers really bring it each week, don’t they? Not to say every episode is perfect but I’ve found every single one to be very entertaining and exactly what I want out of Star Trek in 2023. The combination of standalone stories mixed with underlying character development and arcs is perfect.

As for this week, the idea of encountering a planet that could make you forget everything was weirdly creepy, if not a bit implausible. Even if this wasn’t her showcase episode, I grinned at Ortega’s “I AM THE PILOT!” moment. Also enjoyed the away team being out of sorts on the planet which I thought was well done and not an action overdose like the season opener.

Schal330 ,

Wow, these SNW writers really bring it each week, don’t they?

Don’t they just! Genuinely excited whenever I fire up the episodes and watch the intro everytime (love the intro music!)

Disgustoid ,

I know the feeling! SNW’s theme and opening credits definitely bring back memories of eagerly looking forward to TNG every week. It’s easily my favorite Trek theme since TNG.

theothersparrow ,
@theothersparrow@lemmy.one avatar

SNW really is a masterclass in balancing episodic and narrative storytelling.

I’d love to attend a workshop/lecture with Goldsman, Myers, et al.

IcePenguino ,

Memory loss is one of the scariest things in the known universe. This is a horror episode to me.

deepthaw ,

Similar to how we refer to TOS episodes as “The Nazi Planet” and “The Gangster Planet” this one will be “The Alzheimer’s Planet.”

Continuumguy ,

Thoughts as I watch:

  • So, I’m wondering: is Cayuga a reference to Rod Serling? He named his production company that in reference to the lake in New York.
  • Relationships suck when you are a Starfleet captain who knows your destiny to one day be in a beepie chair.
  • Rigel 7, a deep cut!
  • We have gone (ZERO) days without some sort of Starfleet prime directive problem.
  • Finally, some Ortegas action!
  • “THE HAT IS SUPREME.” I’m going to have to use that in conversation.
  • Oh man, at least she keeps the hat.
  • “Subdermal universal translators” are the new translation microbes
  • Oh boy, they have starfleet tech.
  • Ah, we’ve got a good old-fashioned “Federation citizen takes over a world” episode!
  • “This is a cage.” Heh.
  • Forgetting is a scary side effect for a planet.
  • I get that they were only on there for like four hours, but shouldn’t they have noticed stuff like this their last visit? Or maybe… THEY LOST
  • “Welcome to Memento/50 First Dates Planet”
  • Can still remember how to fight!
  • So I’m guessing Spock is probably one of the more resistant to all of this due to his Vulcan-ness.
  • Man, La’An is having a REALLY bad pair of weeks.
  • Captain Pike even without his memories is still Captain Pike. Makes sense.
  • Okay, I guess Spock isn’t immune.
  • Glad to see the Connie class had GPS.
  • I gotta admit, I feel like Pelia would be good in this episode given just how many memories she has to lose and how many skills she has.
  • SHE FLIES THE SHIP
  • The ship’s computer is great this week.
  • Damn, that is some tough silverware, standing up to phaser blasts.
  • Is it just me or is that a fresco or whatever of Alexander the Great… Zac-ized?
  • Okay, that logic doesn’t quite seem sound, but whatever.
  • So, uhm, be careful about telling her about the Beepy-chair, Chris.
FormerGameDev ,

I thought it was Cuyahoga? correct me if i’m wrong pls

khaosworks ,
@khaosworks@startrek.website avatar

It’s Cayuga, as per the closed captioning, and it’s likely no coincidence. As I noted in my annotations, the Cayuga first appeared in “A Quality of Mercy”, which shares a title with a 1961 Twilight Zone episode starring Leonard Nimoy. And TZ was produced by Serling’s production company, Cayuga Productions.

FormerGameDev ,

Thank you!

williams_482 ,
@williams_482@startrek.website avatar

shares a title with a 1961 Twilight Zone episode starring Leonard Nimoy.

For better or worse, I’m not sure “starring” is quite the right description. Nimoy has like three lines and a couple minutes of screen time. I found it rather jarring to recognize Nimoy early in the episode and then see so little of him after.

khaosworks ,
@khaosworks@startrek.website avatar

Featuring, perhaps.

Continuumguy ,

Yes, I noticed that in your annotations over at… the other place. Interestingly enough, Roddenberry spoke at a memorial for Serling in 1975

khaosworks ,
@khaosworks@startrek.website avatar

I post them as a stand-alone in c/DaystromInstitute every week now.

UESPA_Sputnik ,
@UESPA_Sputnik@lemmy.world avatar

“This is a cage.” Heh.

I hope that one day Captain Pike visits a zoo and says “this is a menagerie”.

autojourno ,

The platter cracked me up.

Ensign — “captain…sir…this directive says all away teams will be issued a Pfaltzgraff serving set for protection?”

Pike — “trust me on that one.”

Klanky ,
@Klanky@sopuli.xyz avatar

Was it just me, or did anyone hear bits and pieces of the score from Rura Penthe while Pike and co were breaking rocks out in the snow?

1Fuji2Taka3Nasubi ,
  • Still somewhat annoyed that there is no seat belt on the shuttle, even if it is to maintain continuity with TOS. M'Benga looked like he was going to bang his head and get a concussion when they were landing.
  • La'an: They won't see us coming.
    Zac: We totally saw you from the other side of the planet a hemisphere away.
  • What was Zac trying to accomplish? He lured them there with the Starfleet Delta, but he was not going to hitch a ride home. He expected whatever ship that comes to inspect to... forget and go away, or suffer some disastrous result when the crew become unable to function? Why not just stay low and be king if he wasn't planning to leave?
Basilisk ,

It wasn’t intentional. The Starfleet Delta was something Zac’s followers had done to honour him, it wasn’t intended as a lure.

khaosworks , (edited )
@khaosworks@startrek.website avatar

Zac didn’t intend for Starfleet to notice the delta. He was content to just stay on Rigel VII as High Lord Zacarias, thinking that Starfleet would never return to the planet because of the debris field and the radiation. But then the Kalar used the delta as a symbol and it got spotted.

PIKE: Zac. We saw your message, the, um… the Delta in the garden. It’s why we came. Isn’t that why you did it?

ZAC: The people here adopted it as my symbol. I should have known better. It’s all getting torn out tomorrow.

1Fuji2Taka3Nasubi ,

Thanks. I tried to watch with subtitles off and predictably missed some of the conversation.

FormerGameDev ,

Outside of Pike and Batel’s relationship, are there any points in this episode that look to connect to anything else in the currently ongoing plotline in SNW? I didn’t really notice anything, it seems like this might be the most standalone episode.

khaosworks ,
@khaosworks@startrek.website avatar

Batel’s promotion was nixed by Judge Advocate Pasalk because of her conduct during Una’s trial in “Ad Astra Per Aspera”.

M’Benga mentions that the reason he and La’An were along was because Pike needed people who could fight without phasers (as per “The Broken Circle” and “Tomorrow and Tomorrow and Tomorrow”).

That’s basically it, I think.

deepthaw ,

M’Benga

You mean “Dr. Seen-Some-Shit.”

Disgustoid ,

I don’t know if we’ll ever see a full episode with flashbacks to everything he’s been through, but oddly enough I don’t mind the intentionally vague references to it so far–leaves it open for our imaginations (and fan fiction) to fill in the gaps.

UhBell ,
@UhBell@lemmy.world avatar

Damn I love this show. I can’t help but wonder if Hemmer would have been affected differently by the radiation if he wasn’t a gorn egg popsicle.

UESPA_Sputnik ,
@UESPA_Sputnik@lemmy.world avatar

Isn’t Spock usually the one to be immune? But he was affected to, so was Una. It’s likely that Hemmer would have been affected as well (for plot reasons anyway).

G59 ,

I almost thought Una’s super healing ability would make her immune/resistant to the radiation damage.

rother_stuebs ,
@rother_stuebs@mastodon.online avatar

@UESPA_Sputnik
Sounds like Troi's telepathic abilities always being mysteriously blocked when the story demands it.

@UhBell

flamingmongoose ,

Enjoyed this very much, the tone was very creepy. Reminded me of the psychological horror episodes only TNG really did.

StillPaisleyCat ,
@StillPaisleyCat@startrek.website avatar

I would link it back to psychological mystery of The Cage and further to its touchstone, the MGM 50s classic Forbidden Planet.

regeya ,

Rigel 7 is literally a callback to The Cage

StillPaisleyCat ,
@StillPaisleyCat@startrek.website avatar

Yes, it’s a direct plot reference to the backstory for The Cage.

I was responding to the comment that it’s like TNG psychological episodes, when I see it as in the tradition of Forbidden Planet where an unknown technology or phenomenon is changing brain function so that subconscious or deep behaviours are revealed.

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