I like this idea too. I also think we should probably just ignore trying to prevent “spoilers” right? Since it’s all getting released at once, no point in trying to pretend it’s not.
Even linear television dropped to 16, then further to 12 or even ten. Some serialized sci-fi shows are 6.
One thing to keep in mind, especially with science fiction and fantasy shows is that they take an enormous amount of time and resources to make in UHD. It’s a very unforgiving medium that shows up every tiny flaw in prosthetic makeup, costume construction and set and prop fabrication. The primary shooting takes much, much longer for each episode, 1.5 to 2 times what it did in the 90s.
Yes, they can take short cuts but there is a price for it in terms of quality. As a concrete example, Picard season three decided to go with ambient lighting from the set rather than move and recalibrate lights for every side of every scene (usual practice). It reduced the amount of time needed to shoot each scene, as they could go immediately from one side and scene to another. It did however mean that the final product was darker than many older fans preferred, especially if they didn’t have the newest OLED televisions.
Another thing to keep in mind is that the actors want to be able to work on other projects or have time for their families. Many shows have more established cast members simply because working on Star Trek no longer means locking into a single show for seven years of their careers.
Anson Mount has said publicly and repeatedly that he found doing the 14 episode second of Discovery took too much of his life. He particularly noted that the bridge filming days were very long and arduous, even though he enjoyed being together with the whole main cast for them. It’s known then that he personally wouldn’t go for a longer season.
One thing to keep in mind, especially with science fiction and fantasy shows is that they take an enormous amount of time and resources to make in UHD. It’s a very unforgiving medium that shows up every tiny flaw in prosthetic makeup, costume construction and set and prop fabrication. The primary shooting takes much, much longer for each episode, 1.5 to 2 times what it did in the 90s.
Yes, they can take short cuts but there is a price for it in terms of quality.
So does film. TNG was shot on 35mm, and even if you assume they were using cheap, shitty film with large grain, that’s still equivalent to well over 3,000 lines of vertical resolution in digital terms. Drop some extra cash on decent 35mm and it makes UHD look like a joke. Obviously I’m aware that they were then converting it to videotape for TV and expected certain shortcuts to be blended by crushing the resolution, but we can watch the film transfers officially now—and bootlegs have been circulating since before that, too, and the show looked fine. All that is to say that TNG was shot with the same considerations in mind that SNW has, but they cranked out 20+ episodes a season for 7 years and it still holds up (especially after season 1).
I don’t disagree with what you’re saying, just the premise: they could do it the way they used to, but people who wear expensive suits would rather spend the money on themselves. Let’s not entertain the idea that it was ever anything else. The reason I asked who’s responsible is not because I don’t understand the motivation, I do, it’s money. I asked so I can smear dog shit on the door handle of his car.
Yes the original film exists, but you can also see the edges of the prostheses, the wear on the sets, and the ripples in the seams of costumes (as regrettably you can see in most seasons of Picard). People watch remasterd TNG anyway, but the rough edges show.
Red and Panavision capture everything all the time now.
Yes, people have worked to that production norm in cinema for nearly a century now, but very few cinematic features are filmed in a week.
Hey, I get that you’re angry, and I totally agree that not enough of the return is going to the creators and crews, but those same folks involved in production are talking about an unrealistic norm of gruelling long hours in production. They need both decent pay and residuals and humane production schedules.
Right, but my point is that it still holds up even then. It still holds up with the original effects, too. Maybe the death of the mid-budget production is the real issue here, because if I were running the show I would aggressively slash the fuck out of the VFX budget to make room for additional episodes over a longer shooting schedule, and the idea of sacrificing eye candy and having the show just look decent doesn’t really fly anymore. I think even a showrunner with serious weight to throw around would still promptly be fired for shooting a science fiction show that went 5 to 10 episodes without a major action setpiece because he wanted to film people calmly talking about ethical dilemmas in a room with flat, even TV lighting.
I agree with your points about overworking the cast and crew, but that’s not actually necessary either: it’s well within Paramount’s power to spend the money on doing it right and take the time on doing it right and treat people like they aren’t animals. And if wishes were horses, beggars would ride.
Ultimately, there is one person at whom the buck stopped and the decision was made—there always is—and I still want to smear dog shit on the door handles of his car.
Don’t get me wrong, SNW is great: in my mind, it’s the first good Star Trek show to broadcast since VOY went off the air (not a high bar to clear, I know, but it’s still meant as a compliment), and I just wish there was more of it instead of the other stupid shit Paramount incinerates money on.
I work in the film industry and can say, with certainty, that TNG was not shot with the same consideration.
Television back then knew it was being mastered for SDTV and the artists had a good idea of what it meant they could get away with compared to something that would be screened in 35mm. Final screening medium has always been the most important consideration, not capture medium.
Audiences have also gotten less forgiving of visual quality and less willing to suspend disbelief as the bar for quality has steadily risen. It means that shows are both working on higher definition target mediums and under more scrutiny than ever.
Like, I love TNG but go watch and tell me that it looks half as good as SNW.
Yeah. Hearing stories from TNG and other shows of the era, filming took a lot of long days and the show would crank out one episode per week. Even then, you could tell that there were some episodes written to give actors a break.
Isn't that why you have bottle episodes that keep things more like a stage show (some of best and some.of worst are bottles) and also you have episodes centered on part of the cast maybe a few to give others a break then another charecter has an episode. Even in the old series they found ways around the issues.
Bottle episodes don’t perhaps save as much as they used to.
With the UHD, the bottle episodes involve a great deal of interior ship scenes with extensive lighting issues. Anson Mount has talked about ‘bridge days’ as being some of the most gruelling shooting days on Discovery.
Yes can bottle episodes save on new/redressed sets and new props, but they also cause more wear and tear on the sets themselves. The makeup challenges are no less although SNW has just has Spock with prostheses within the main cast.
In the end, we have to accept that for new shows to be visually engaging for new fans, they need to be up to the same product standards as other new science fiction. That standard is very high and there are few short cuts.
I don’t think 24 episodes will be happening any time soon, but it would be nice to have 12-14. Ten is so few, and with the ongoing strikes, it’s going to be a while until another season happens.
I'm pretty cool with subpar episodes. They still add to the world, and give me something to watch with characters I enjoy. Of the series I like(almost all of them), there isn't a single episode I skip on rewatch. The "bad" ones bulk out the series and make it last longer.
yeah to each their own, but my feeling was that the subpar episodes gave them time for better pacing, and character development. With these 10 episode seasons it always feels like barely getting through the overarching story, no time for subtleties or good character development and background episodes. Some of my favourite TNG/VOY episodes are the ‘filler’ episodes where the world wasn’t ending and they just had a fun adventure.
“I lied. I cheated. I bribed men to cover the crimes of other men. I am an accessory to murder. But the most damning thing of all… I think I can live with it. And if I had to do it all over again, I would. Garak was right about one thing, a guilty conscience is a small price to pay for the safety of the Alpha Quadrant. So I will learn to live with it. Because I can live with it. I can live with it. “Also I’m a god now”
Even the Romulan-heavy Star Trek: Picard Season 1 avoided addressing or explaining the supernova in any detail.
Explaining? Stars go supernova occasionally, there’s your explanation. There doesn’t need to be further cause or intervention behind it.
IMO this is a solution (or really several) looking for a problem that just doesn’t exist. As it stands and despite fan speculation, Romulus was destroyed by a natural disaster, which is actually something that happens on Earth and in the wider universe.
Anything involving Romulus’ star means that ‘saving the planet’ is completely impossible.
Eventually, yes, but if it were possible to collapse the exploding star in a way that didn’t totally roast the planet it would buy a fair bit of time to continue the evacuation. It’ll get very cold and photosynthesis will stop, but with enough power and food, the population could hang on for several years if needed.
Not spontaneously, with only a handful of years’ notice, they don’t.
I’m all for Trek science being a little weird, but it seems very likely that there was some funny business going on for the star to suddenly blow up and threaten the entire galaxy.
The wiggle room within Star Trek is that the Tkon Empire was supposedly wiped out by a supernova despite being a highly advanced civilization, and in “Second Sight” the DS9 crew boosts the top speed of a ship to warp 9.5, which suggests that a supernova can have superliminal consequences.
But there’s nothing to suggest the Tkon supernova was a natural phenomenon, and the hijinks they were up to in “Second Sight” certainly wasn’t.
Explaining? Stars go supernova occasionally, there’s your explanation. There doesn’t need to be further cause or intervention behind it.
Stars don’t just randomly supernova. Stars have extremely predictable lifecycles. It’s hard to believe a warp-capable species never made it past a 19th century understanding of how their sun works, especially given how fundamental the underlying principles are to our own ability to observe and understand the universe.
It’s a plot hole in ST '09, though I agree that maybe it is best ignored unless they can come up with a truly compelling explanation.
I am really struggling to get excited about a Trek entry for the first time in my life with this one.
Ironically, I’ve always thought a S31 show could work if handled like “Tinker, Taylor, Soldier, Spy” in space. However how they handled it in Dis makes me think this will be Mission Impossible in space and that doesn’t sound appealing to me.
The latest rumours before the strike characterized the movie as a cross between MI and Guardians of the Galaxy.
If they broaden out an ensemble to include other legacy characters across the franchise with S31, intelligence and/or temporal shenanigans, it could be a lot of fun.
They’ve been trying to give The Empress her own show and Worf said they were necessary. Depicting them as an official branch of Starfleet instead of a conspiracy within Starfleet also grants them legitimacy that they didn’t have in DS9. Even their plot in DSC S2 is specifically depicted as their AI going rogue rather than S31 doing anything wrong.
The way he says it implies he’s not being entirely truthful.
BASHIR: So which department are you with? SLOAN: Let’s just say I belong to another branch of Starfleet Intelligence. Our official designation is Section thirty one.
I don’t think I’ve ever heard someone say, “let’s just say,” and had it been followed by a truthful statement.
It’s not a phrase people use to indicate they’re lying - it suggests a long story or a complicated arrangement, but a fundamentally truthful one. This is backed up at the end of the episode, when Starfleet Command tells Sisko to take a hike when he asks about S31.
I still don’t get the impression that S31 being legitimate was the writer’s intention at the time. That Sloan is or was from Starfleet Intelligence and uses Starfleet resources while Starfleet Command looks the other way also works for interpreting his statement. Starfleet Command refusing to confirm or deny S31’s existence can be used to back up basically any position. For instance, if S31 is a conspiracy within Starfleet, then Command can’t acknowledge it or they would have to do something about it; acting like they don’t know anything means they can keep letting S31 do what they want.
Even the bit of the charter mentioned in ENT implies that Harris and S31 are taking a very liberal interpretation of the Starfleet Charter. “Reread the Charter, Article 14, Section 31. There are a few lines that make allowances for bending the rules during times of extraordinary threat.” But S31 operates day-to-day against ordinary and mundane threats, like everyday Romulan politics. And that bit doesn’t seem to mandate the creation of a special branch just for extreme threats. Rather, it seems like it’s there to cover the random crazy things that Starfleet crews run into once every few years, like taking a BoP back in time to gather some whales not resulting in punishment because of the extreme threat posed by the whale probe, even though they blatantly violated a bunch of rules regarding time travel.
I think of Section 31 as the Federation’s dirty little secret, operating off the books, weapon of last resort. I wasn’t surprised that the Federation was capable of things that didn’t fit its public doctrine when the utter destruction of the people of Federation by an outside, more powerful force was nigh. The Federation leans into diplomacy, but I never thought it impossible for them to have bag of tricks – Section 31. To me, the Federation would let the Federation fall because, say, member worlds left. But, not when something is about to destroy most or all of the people of the Federation.
I’d love to see a Trek game by a competent adventure dev like Wadget Eye. Hopefully Resurgence will be good, but I’ll not be holding my breath; most recent Trek games have been low quality cash-grabs, bulging with microtransactions.
There are two Star Trek total conversions for Stellaris, even, each with their own unique approach. New Civilizations might even be a little better, imo.
Also, Resurgence already came out, to mixed reviews—but no microtransactions! It’s coming out on Steam in May, but that’s because it was a timed Epic exclusive.
I tried to play it when it came out, but there were some visual issues that started to give me a migraine so I put it down and just haven’t picked it up since. At some point I’ll give it another shot and see if they fixed the migraine issue haha
Thank you for the correction, I remember reading about the Epic exclusivity now. I look forward to picking it up when it goes on sale! Such is my way. I knew there was a solid Star Trek Stellaris scene, but I’m just a dabbler in 4x games. My favorite Trek games are probably A Final Unity and the Interplay TOS adventures from 30 years ago.
Edited to add, Bridge Crew is moderately fun as a single player game. Would probably be a blast with a group of friends.
Major spoilers in the summaries attached to the titles here. I couldn’t help myself from reading them - holy shit. I was excited for this before, but wow.
!While plot details haven’t been shared, we do have an understanding of when the movie will take place decades before the original 2009 Star Trek film. This is very confusing, as the 2009 star trek film takes place across multiple years, and multiple timelines. This might mean decades before the main events of the movie. The main events of 2009 take place in the Kelvin Timeline in 2255. However the Kelvin timeline only started in 2233. So if this takes place anytime before 2233, it would be canonical to both the Kelvin and Prime timeline.!<
!The other option is that it takes place decades before the events of the movie in the prime timeline, in 2387. An option this movie has is to tie into the backstory of Star Trek: Picard, and possibly even explain why the Romulan Sun went supernova in the first place! I doubt this will be the case, as it will probably be set in the Kelvin Timeline, sometime after the Narada destroys the U.S.S. Kelvin.!<
Sounds to me like it’ll be >!taking place in the prime timeline either way!<.
I really appreciate this deep dive that integrates the as yet unseen clips from the season trailers with the sneak peek for this episode. Well done Trek Central.
I was interested to see that this is a Maja Vrvilo directed episode. I have really liked her work on the Secret Hideout Trek shows. The article mentions SNW Children of the Comet, but she’s also directed some of the more tense Discovery and Picard episodes as well as the Short Trek Runaway. These include Discovery Perpetual Infinity and Die Trying, and Picard The Impossible Box and Broken Pieces.
After viewing the season trailer and the sneak peek, I became worried about Ortegas as well. Fingers crossed she doesn’t have anything happen to her, there is still a lot to develop for her.
We see Ortegas flying a shuttle in a combat style landing in the main trailer, perhaps she has a reason to stay with the shuttle (or prep it) even once Pike is in the big chair in his combat gear.
We were promised ‘MOrtegas’ in the messaging leading up to this season. Perhaps they didn’t want to reveal what’s coming for her.
You seem to be assuming that a direct to streaming movie was Paramount’s preference rather than a second option to go forward in the face of Michelle Yeoh’s scheduling limitations following her winning just about every major award in 2022 for her performance in Everything, Everywhere, All At Once.
The series buy was already decided but not announced due to the situation on Yeoh’s side. Kurtzman has basically salvaged the situation with a streaming movie. Hopefully, it will also get a limited IMAX air theatrical release too but there’s no word on that.
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