I set up a 4-day trip years ago and my SO requested the time off. Denied. Changed the reservation, paid a fee and again denied. In fact, every weekend in June through August was denied due to "seniority" and other employees taking their vacations.
I changed the reservation again (and paid another fee) and told my SO the dates they'll be sick.
We called early in the morning on the way to a great trip. It felt great. FAFO
When I take vacation, I always phrase it as "I am taking vacation from X to Y". Requesting time off for vacation you're owed is such a scam to allow people with little power feel like they can control you.
Yeah, I had a manager try to pull "You'll need to find coverage for the day." I'll ask around, but that kind of sounds like your job. Everybody said no to me, so it's going to be even harder for you. Best of luck!
I had a manager try that with me back in the day when I was one of the more reliable people at my job. They told me that if I didn't find coverage I might not have a job when I come back.
They didn't appreciate me calling their bluff and saying that I'll be sure to give them a call when I get back to see if I still have my job.
Yup, this is how I do it. Had ONE manager try the whole "we actually NEED you to come in, we don't have enough coverage" thing the day I was scheduled to start my vacation, so I sent them a picture from the window of the plane I was on.
It entirely depends on the particular workplace and what is involved, but either way a decent manager should work with you.
"John, Sarah, and James have already asked for that time off, and we have to have someone in the shop. Would you be able to change to this time to this time?" And you never, ever, ever call someone in when they are on PTO. If you, as a manager, okayed it, it's on you if there's not enough coverage for whatever reason.
In fairness, I work in Search and Rescue, so operations like mine and other emergency-related workplaces can't just be like "Oh well, I guess we won't have coverage that day, Joe wanted to go hunting." If you work in an office and your work literal lives aren't depending on you and others being there, then managers should work around it as best they can.
You may work in Search and Rescue but that doesn't mean they can steal from your paycheck. In workplaces that give you a set amount of time off, that time off is treated like money you are owed. If you are fired or quit, they have to pay you out.
They literally owe you the time off. You earned it. If they don't let you take it when you need it, it's like they're not paying you for work you already did. Would you accept that? I'm guessing no amount of guilting ("it's Search and Rescue!") would convince you to give them back your paycheck.
It's their fault if they don't hire enough people for you to take a vacation. Not yours. You have to be rested in order to do all the tough aspects of your job, or people could die. Think of it that way.
That's how I approve time off. I realize people have dependents and school vacations and shit, so - if it even comes to that - I'll ask if they can move it. But I see their 'request' more as a notice that they'll be away, because they can always be 'sick'. So I'm trying to preserve the trusting relationship instead.
Because honestly, the world will keep turning even if we miss that arbitrary deadline by two weeks. Or six months.
They don't give us enough vacation time anyways, everyone should be maxing their sick days too. Assuming you're not someone prone to actually getting sick.
So, in my country (I believe it's the same in the rest of the EU), we have fixed amount of PTO days every year (the amount depends on your contract, but, like pay, it cannot be below 4 weeks), and you HAVE TO USE THEM.
Some people try to build up PTO reserves for whatever reason, and usually their employers have to force them to take time off.
That sounds like you're not being a team player. It is absolutely vital that we maintain a skeleton crew because your manager's bonus is dependent on cutting payroll to the point of nonfunctionality.
It's rarely worth an argument. Especially for the early millennials that came up when boomers were still running around everywhere.
I don't know what the article says they're doing, but yeah, if there's a way to do something without having to talk to cranky old people about it, we're just going to do shit the quiet way.
Why give them the opportunity to turn it into an argument?
Dealing with those boomers is like dealing with toddlers.
I’ve explained this so many times. I grew up in rural Georgia and I’ve been shout and yelled at so many times by some old boomer dude that I’m just immune to it. Would rather just avoid listening to their bullshit at all.
Personally I prefer Elder Millennial. Makes it sound more dignified and you can never go wrong with an Iliza Schlesinger reference (she coined the term and named a brilliant stand up special after it) 😁
The "Oregon Trail generation" is generally known as the Xennials which is people born from 77-83, so it's not just Elder Millenials. I'm in this group and think Oregon Trail generation is a cooler name, but that's probably because I played a shitload of Oregon Trail.
One of my biggest social media pet peeves. A screenshot of a headline is a useless post. They either took the screenshot and chose to not include the link or - more likely - they copied it from some Instagram page
It denies everyone the article, it's not searchable, and it's inaccessible for people using things like screen readers. People who screenshot text deserve a special place in hell.
Not the point...and the guy I was replying to posted the link already. My issue is that posting a screenshot without the article means you have to then look it up
Workers who receive 11 to 15 days of PTO each year are more likely to use up their days, Rodney says, but there's a significant drop-off once people get 16 or more days.
And here I am, thinking my 30 days are too little.
No, I think my supervisor would approve as many days as I want as long as I also get all of my work done. There’s always just too much work to do, it seems.
But that's not your problem. If you cannot handle the work assigned to you, you are overworked and that's the fault of your employer. I think what millennials and zoomers are doing is just not falling for the bullshit we've been living with for so long.
I think this bullshit is more prevalent today than in the past. Companies found more loopholes to go around (for example unlimited vacations[1]), the worker protections aren't enforced as strictly.
I believe this phenomenon is likely US specific.
[1] unlimited vacations look great on paper, but with them the company no longer needs to track of 2 weeks of vacations, so they no longer need to pay them when you leave the company and not used them and also doesn't have to force you to use it. The peer pressure makes you unlikely to take more anyway to not look like a slacker.
God, same. But please realise that it's not your fault if you have more work than can be done. Take the time off to refresh. Both your mental health and your work performance will be the better for it.
I've recently got in the habit of scheduling all of my time off for the year in one go. Sure sometimes I regret it, because I'm right in the middle of something when time off comes, but ah well
There’s always just too much work to do, it seems.
I remember reading a quote from someone that said something along the lines of "No one on their deathbed ever says 'I wish I'd spent more time at the office'".
Fair! I suppose find myself with sooo much excess vacation time since WFH means I don’t have to take “me” days to recharge like I did when I had to go into a horrible open office every day.
Also, in the US, employers have to pay departing employees for any unused PTO. If the PTO is "unlimited," there's (perhaps counterintuitively) nothing to reimburse.
Honestly, having had both paid out PTO and unlimited, I'll take unlimited. It sounds like you're getting fucked by not getting your PTO paid out, but you also aren't incentivized to hold onto your PTO on the off chance you get paid out if you leave. I've found my mental health to be better now that I'm actively taking my leave instead of rationing it since I can just take it without wondering if I'm going to have to take an unpaid day late in the year.
If your employer is halfway decent, sure. Unfortunately some (like mine) will start denying pto requests once you hit 2 weeks. So then you say "fine, I'll take it unpaid" and they say "that's not an option." The fuck it is...
That's only true in California. Accrued PTO does not have to be paid out, nor rolled into the next year. Some employers will pay it out but it's not a law. Except in California.
When minimum wage workers requesting vacation time 3 months in advance during a non-holiday month get denied, knowing full well that the weekly schedules arent posted until just about the day before they go into effect... Yeah. People are going to do what they need to do. Goodness knows I did everytime that happened. You'd never guess how many times I've claimed getting Mono before covid was an option.
My wife and mys manager when we worked at the same place once told each of us separately in out reviews:
You do great, I love that you finish your work early, but the other people in the office dont like that you go home AT 5 (9 hour shift w/ 30m lunch) because they stay an extra 2-4 hours regularly.
Said it to me first, I just told her it sounds like her salary (I was hourly) employees suck at their jobs. She just kinda stares at me (this is the exact bluntness she promoted me to working with her for so...)
When she said it to my wife SHE went off on one about how she used to do those other people's jobs and that it's ridiculous that they can't do it in the same amount of time and would dare demand that she stay extra time just to appease their incompetence
She straight up admitted to us all the 40-60 year olds just didnt like that we could do our jobs and go home because we could type faster than 12 WPM
If you can’t handle me being out for a week how are you going to handle me quitting from being overworked from you not being able to handle being out for a week?
Malingering millennials are “quiet shirking”, discharging their duties at or beyond the level expected of them, but singing the company song with tones of sarcasm in their voices and sometimes even rolling their eyes
The Swedish vacation law (Semesterlag 1977:480) amateurishly translated by me. And I am in no way experienced enough in our labour law to comment on how it looks for those not working full time. The short lesson is to Remember Ådalen, or those that fought, bled and died four our labour rights.
4 § En arbetstagare har rätt till tjugofem semesterdagar varje semesterår [...]
An employee have right to twentyfive vacation days per year
12 § Om inte annat har avtalats, ska semesterledigheten förläggas så, att arbetstagaren får en ledighetsperiod av minst fyra veckor under juni-augusti[...]
If nothing else have been agreed upon, the vacation is to be scheduled such that the employee get a vacation period of at least four weeks during june -august
Depending on where you're from you'll face different challenges. If you're an EU/Schengen citizen you can pretty much just mosy on over here. If you have a full-time job and/or enough money, as well as some form of health insurance you'll be able to get a personnummer quite easily. If you're outside of the EU things get trickier, but having a job lined up here will make things easier.
There's also the spousal path, though given our current nazi-xenophobic government I'm expecting a lot of those avenues to get tougher.
It sounds like because there's a shitload of distrust for workplace managers and HR departments, some workers are being very reserved about what they tell their bosses.
If bosses are going to presume you're lazy for taking breaks and using PTO, it might be better to offer a less triggering explanation.
Very much like if a website refuses to serve Firefox or VPNs, it might be useful to hide your website and VPN use.
My boss after approving my time off: So what you gonna do with your time off?
Me: rest.
Boss: going anywhere?
Me: I'm gonna rest.
Boss: ohh you gotta do something fun.
Me: I am, resting.
I'm not telling you shit you weird fuck, plus you dont pay me enough to go on holiday so imma take advantage of not having to be here by resting my over worked body.
I work retail, my bosses like to think they own us out of work, he does not like it when I tell him I consider myself unemployed when I'm not actively being paid by the company.
I added every normal contact to my white list and put my phone on do not disturb when I'm living my actual life, anyone I actually want to talk to can contact me and I already ignore private numbers or numbers not in my contacts, sonthey can't try and trick me.
If "quiet quitting" was just doing the absolute bare minimum, wtf is "quiet vacationing?" Showing up to work but then spending all day in VR at a virtual beach while at your desk? 🤷🏻♂️
Quiet quitting was doing what you were hired to do, and not taking on stuff beyond your role. I'm guessing that quiet vacationing means you take the breaks that are in your contract, or that you sleep in your free time.
Oooh right, that makes sense. My job has no issues with this actually. If you end up moving somewhere (outside of the Nordics, presumably) they need to be notified for tax and insurance reasons, but if you travel abroad and bring your work with you they genuinely don't care so long as you can get your job done. Heck it even happens quite often.
My first thought was'disconnecting' and going fully offline while you're on vacation. No emails, no work phone, airplane mode on your personal phone, etc.
I still don't understand how people got "quiet quitting" so twisted, or why. The term came from businesses looking at employee behaviours and discovering leading indicators of quitting. It had nothing to do with working-to-rule, and was entirely about being able to identify that an employee had one foot out the door.
This is a really simple concept, which makes the reappropriation of the term seem purposful.
